Tuesday, June 19, 2007

WoW Insider Interviews Nihilum

Courtesy of WoW Insider and a great job of it too; Here is a link to a Exclusive Interview with Awake (Nihilum 2nd in command and top Paladin) of Nihilum WoW tops raiding Guild, who recently beat the entire game. Its worth reading and its informative in the tidbits of information about what it takes to beat the game, encounters as well as some class info. Its worth reading!

Linked here.


Joyd said...

Thanks for adding me! I agree, it was a great read; his comments on the roles of paladins in the top-end raids intrigued me especially.

Galoheart said...

Yeah i agree, everybit of it was interesting especially the role of Paladins or the different Paladins spec roles at their level of the endgame. Its not the first time i've read stuff by Awake. I actually read stuff from their community board over on their site as a site member. Awake does seem like a pretty level headed guy all around and quite knowledgable of the different things i've read.

What catch me was that in the complete end game as they saw it was Rets & Protection has almost no role due to nature of encounters and also as a spec we have nothing to add thats of that much value to a raid group. Thats what strikes me.

On another note to me he's not saying that in all instances that as Protection Paladin we have no real role. What i get he's saying is ...its situational and depend on the encounter. Yet overall in the end don't seem like we have much function.

So that has me thinking, beyond tanking some encounters and all will be situational best i can think. Rets need working on as a class. But as Protection Paladin we need to be given something unique as ability or utility to make us viable in any raid group.

The rest of the guild stuff in interesting as well. Strikes me as real teamwork and thats what a guild should really be.

Karl said...

I've heard that sort of stuff before, but there are two things to consider.

First, you really need to think about what YOUR goal in the game is. If you plan to be a hard-core die-hard take-it-as-a-job serious raider, then yes, in the endgame, there are not as many uses for paladins other than holy, as hard-core raid groups will have all the slots filled with optimal specs.

But.. there are many many prot pallies that are tanking end-game content, as you know from the forums over at maintankadin.

Myself?.. I enjoy the versitility, even if I can't do everything as well as "pure" specs. In the last week, I tanked one instance, I main-healed one, and I off-tanked/off-healed another. Having that type of versatility in your guild is great.

So I'm really tired about the view of hard-core raiders (and certain Blizz developers) souring the waters for pallies. If I knew everything that I know now, I might have rolled a druid instead, but, the roles are actually similar.

Kaziel said...

IMO, take anything said by Bleed Edge Raiders with a grain of salt. While I don't doubt they know what they're doing, part of their view is that a class will only have one role. Warrior: Tank. Paladin: Heal. etc. But certain abilities from other specs are quite useful. For example... mortal strike, when fighting bosses that have abilities that can give them heals. Not sure how many there are in tBC, but I remember doing Ebonroc in BWL. Basically, he used a debuff on the target he was attacking that for when he did damage, it healed him. While you could taunt him off the target, he probably still would get a hit or two in, thus having Mortal Strike debuff on him would help out. Again, while they can do it their way, they see it as the only way. If you raid with them, you raid their way or you go raid elsewhere. It's not wrong, because it's an opinion, it's not right either.

Galoheart said...

I for one would like to think there are more than one way to win , or build a team caparable of winning or accomplishing a end task.

The thing is with that is when one has tried a found a successfull path through the mindfield of a battlefield and gotten to the other side then in essence that becomes the standard for effiency of getting from one side of the battlefield to the other..no flying mounts included. Thus Nihilum's point as i see it.

However as that is now the proven standard its tested and proven. Unfortunately its what everyone behind them will now do. Why try another route to waste time or manpower or delay the journey. There aren't many who would want to invest the time to find a different path through to the end. Yet it may exist. Enter the possibility of the Paladin route as a tank, yes were not a warrior and all that a warrior has. It may be possible to accomplish the same task in getting to the other side of a mine field in deciding to TRY and find ANOTHER path. it may be possible and doable, the other thing is few will be willing to give one the benefit of the doubt or try to find that parth.

Yes another path may exist, but when one is now proven, as much as even myself will like to find the other parth to the end as well as many others. The battle is convincing others or guilds to see your point that there is another way .....less optimum, less efficient....but doable.

Warrior Tank - Proven
Paladin Tank - Not as proven as Warrior's overall. Does't not mean we can't. May just not Always be as efficient. Yet there are things we excell in all the same.

For me i personally would like to see every class having a shot in whatever ende game content it is as long as they have quality in their spec with caperability. How a person decides that group makeup is up to them within some parameter. But give everyone of the class equal shot to a boss.

Military make teams, they pick various people for their role and figure out a strategy. Sometimes you don't have the optimum team or skills. So the team have to work harder to reach the same end. They overcome the defiency and adapt a different stratergy to win. I know i was there. i did 8 years of it. Its Overcoming and Adapting. There is no one way unless Blizzard make it so diliberately. Just people finding it hard to adapt and find other ways to win.

Kaziel said...

Off-Topic: You were in the military? Really? What branch? What MOS? I'm ex-US Army, formerly military intel.

Galoheart said...

I did 8 years in the US Navy in Shipboard Propulsion Engineering. Was Gas Turbine Tech. Left as a E-6 in my short time. Fas fun. Was best bunch of guys i every worked with. We were misfits in the begining as everyone usually is. But in the end you work as a team as you know how that is.

Paladin wise, we wear Plate. Blizzard give us the damm plate let us use it for what its for. We are caperable and can tank. What makes us not as even as Warriors as you all know and some knows better than i do is we have so much to overcome to do the role that we have to give up many things to get there. Warriors don't. Yet we don't have many unique utility or can use more offensive skills. That gives us more proven worth in the end to find another way to the end boss.

Galoheart said...

Anyone been in military got plenty leadership skills, if you been there long enough you been in the role too. Some better than others. Sometime we don't like to admit also we can lead. Some keeps it under raps.

Joyd said...

There may be a lot of truth in that; paladin tanks do some things better than warriors and some things worse. I know that pallies are known for being great tanks against mobs that hit light but fast because of our reactive damage, but CC can be more difficult with us tanking.
There was a time when paladins were clearly inferior tanks in most all cases; anyone who's been raiding for a long time has spent most of their raiding career working with warrior tanks, and is likely very used to working with warrior tanks. A style adjustment might be difficult. (On the other hand, there are some unusual fights where a non-tanking class makes the best tank because of idiosyncrasies of the fight, and people seem to be able to adapt fine to that, but those are the exception to the rule.)